Jon Richardson and Matt Forde interview
So what have you concluded at the end of all this? Have you found any of the answers you were looking for?
JR: I feel very lucky – blessed, really – that my circumstances are what they are. I think I was struggling with guilt that I have such a fortunate existence. I’ve got good friends, a good family and a job that I adore, that pays me enough to live comfortably. And I’ve now met someone who I love. I struggle with the guilt of that, and force this long-term doom on it, almost like saying “Well, you’re happy now, but it might all end.”
What I’ve learned is that while those are your circumstances, you should be grateful. Appreciating it is the only thing to do, otherwise you’re being ungrateful. People who would kill to be in your position won’t thank you for being unhappy. I’m less worried about things going wrong. We’ve met people whose marriages have failed, or their relationships with their kids aren’t what they want them to be, and it’s just something that you deal with. You don’t get to just work life out and be fine for the rest of it. You just have to keep going.
What about you, Matt? Has it changed your perspective on anything?
MF: Little bits and pieces, I think. I think maybe I’ve learned to be a bit more sensible. I didn’t feel like I needed to profoundly reassess my world view in the way that Jon did. I wasn’t carrying the same sort of burdens around. I think my favourite part of all this were my conversations with Jon’s mum. It made me realise where a lot of your stuff comes from, Jon. Not that you had a difficult upbringing or anything like that. It’s just that your mum is such an intensely thoughtful person, and I think that thoughtfulness is where a lot of your things have their roots.
JR: And you learned that you can’t drive a campervan.
MF: I can drive a bloody campervan. I can drive it better than you.
Did your relationship survive sharing Florence together?
MF: Yeah. It’s difficult, because I was driving, and he was constantly holding the dashboard. I knew he was doing it because he felt unsafe, but I found it really distracting. I could feel him wanting to say “Oh, that’s the kerb.” “I know it’s the fucking kerb.”
JR: What do you expect me to say when you drive on the kerb? As much as I’ve learned to be happy, driving is a fundamental. You can either do it or you can’t. And driving on the kerb is incorrect. It’s not about interpretation. You can’t say “You know I’ve discovered that sometimes it’s right to drive on the kerb.” It’s just wrong. You also stalled it on a roundabout.
MF: You stalled it loads of times.
JR: I stalled it once, on the first day.
MF: It’s a difficult thing to drive. I hadn’t driven for a few years.
JR: He was banned.
MF: I’ve got a clean license. I’ve never even had a parking ticket.
Were you having to wave goodbye to the crew, who were off to stay in a nice hotel, leaving you cooped up in the van?
JR: Some nights, yeah. Although if we were filming in a city, we stayed in a hotel as well. But there were a few occasions when they disappeared off for the night and left us in the van.
MF: But some of those places were wonderful. Especially the Lake District. It was the nicest campsite I’ve ever been to. It was right on the water, just beautiful. It was so much fun there. Oddly, although this was a programme about growing up, it also allowed us to be kids again.
Jon Richardson Grows Up is on Channel 4 on Mondays from 15 September at 10pm.
